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Thread: Lightweight for my VE

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Posts: 21-30 of 34
2012-06-19 23:48:42
#21
Originally Posted by gio94sr20ve
The purpose of the pulleys is not just weight but it slows down the water pump and in return will net you less water friction. Slows the alternator.slowing down the accessories reduce the effort the motor needs to move them in the first place.
But for 250.00 do not buy the other 2 pullies.
This is true of under-drive pulleys. It is tough to make sure sometimes that you're actually getting under-drive pulleys or not. The water pump pulleys almost all are, but the others are a crap shoot I think?

My major point is that the G-Spec crank pulley already under-drives the A/C and alternator section of things. I don't believe it under-drives the P/S or water pump stuff though, if it does it isn't by much. So you're already doing some under-driving already.

Originally Posted by Vadim
OEM water pump runs all of the time
You can't compare an OEM water pump to an electric in this way. The OEM water pump runs all the time but doesn't involve the radiator in the system until the thermostat opens. With an electric pump (unless you install it in the OEM position) if you run it all the time in the suggested configurations it will always draw water through the radiator, which is why things take for ever to warm up if it stays on all the time.
2012-06-19 23:49:56
#22
Originally Posted by Vadim
Going from 2.5" to 3" doesn't always get you more power, your header design will matter more at power gain. It's all about exhaust velocity not size, if you go too big you start loosing power because the exhaust gasses will cool down and create back pressure.
I'm going to murder you Vadim.

Originally Posted by Vadim
Keep in mind that VE cranks are 4 counterweight, they are not as internally balanced as the DE 8 counterweights. This is why VE's are pickier on crank pulleys.
Huh?!
2012-06-20 03:04:53
#23
Originally Posted by Vadim
Like Ben said it's as good as the controller. OEM water pump runs all of the time, I would run an electric one and keep it completely off until 150*F or so. That way it would heat up the car faster (in theory).



Going from 2.5" to 3" doesn't always get you more power, your header design will matter more at power gain. It's all about exhaust velocity not size, if you go too big you start loosing power because the exhaust gasses will cool down and create back pressure.

Keep in mind that VE cranks are 4 counterweight, they are not as internally balanced as the DE 8 counterweights. This is why VE's are pickier on crank pulleys. I went back to stock crank pulley and haven't looked back. I do still have the Gspec WP pulley though to avoid cavitation.



i dont like this post
2012-06-20 03:20:05
#24
Originally Posted by BenFenner
I'm going to murder you Vadim.


Now now, I'm not being a muscle car minded guy here. Bigger is better if you can provide enough exhaust velocity. If you can't, then you loose the ability to scavenge efficiently too (I am not talking about turbo's here, just NA VE goodness with a ton of overlap in cams).

Originally Posted by BenFenner

Huh?!


Looking at the logs, I made over 10whp NA switching back to stock crank VE pulley from a Gspec VE pulley. This is what I am talking about when I say my VE did not like lightweight pulley post 7k rpm, it would sound like the power just dropped off.
2012-06-20 03:55:10
#25
Originally Posted by Vadim
Now now, I'm not being a muscle car minded guy here. Bigger is better if you can provide enough exhaust velocity. If you can't, then you loose the ability to scavenge efficiently too (I am not talking about turbo's here, just NA VE goodness with a ton of overlap in cams).



Looking at the logs, I made over 10whp NA switching back to stock crank VE pulley from a Gspec VE pulley. This is what I am talking about when I say my VE did not like lightweight pulley post 7k rpm, it would sound like the power just dropped off.


O_o

Originally Posted by Vadim
Like Ben said it's as good as the controller. OEM water pump runs all of the time, I would run an electric one and keep it completely off until 150*F or so. That way it would heat up the car faster (in theory).



Going from 2.5" to 3" doesn't always get you more power, your header design will matter more at power gain. It's all about exhaust velocity not size, if you go too big you start loosing power because the exhaust gasses will cool down and create back pressure.

Keep in mind that VE cranks are 4 counterweight, they are not as internally balanced as the DE 8 counterweights. This is why VE's are pickier on crank pulleys. I went back to stock crank pulley and haven't looked back. I do still have the Gspec WP pulley though to avoid cavitation.


^Dude lol.
2012-06-20 04:10:52
#26
Alright I don't see what's the big deal about that post. We all know 4cw cranks are not as internally balanced as 8cw cranks, thus they really more on external balancing aka your crank pulley, which also works as a damper (rubber between pulley and belt ribs). All Aluminum pulleys don't have that damper ability.

As for exhausts:
VE cams (48* for 20ve) usually have a ton more overlap then then any of the DE cams (even JWT ones). This means header design, back pressure, scavenging or lack there off, matter a lot more then on a DE.

When I switched to N1 cams I lost power (74* of overlap), with lots of tuning I was able to get back the power that I lost, but with a 2.5" SSAC header I was limited due to a crappy secondary merge collector on them. Thus unless you get a new header you are not getting the full potential of N1's.
2012-06-20 04:14:29
#27
Originally Posted by BenFenner

You can't compare an OEM water pump to an electric in this way. The OEM water pump runs all the time but doesn't involve the radiator in the system until the thermostat opens. With an electric pump (unless you install it in the OEM position) if you run it all the time in the suggested configurations it will always draw water through the radiator, which is why things take for ever to warm up if it stays on all the time.


Do you usually remove the oem thermostat too? I was assuming that stays in place. In which case electric water pump gains might be as grand as I would have hoped.
2012-06-20 05:59:43
#28
Look what I got from Greg @ Gspec today:



2012-06-20 12:54:15
#29
Originally Posted by Vadim
Alright I don't see what's the big deal about that post. We all know 4cw cranks are not as internally balanced as 8cw cranks, thus they really more on external balancing aka your crank pulley, which also works as a damper (rubber between pulley and belt ribs). All Aluminum pulleys don't have that damper ability.

As for exhausts:
VE cams (48* for 20ve) usually have a ton more overlap then then any of the DE cams (even JWT ones). This means header design, back pressure, scavenging or lack there off, matter a lot more then on a DE.

When I switched to N1 cams I lost power (74* of overlap), with lots of tuning I was able to get back the power that I lost, but with a 2.5" SSAC header I was limited due to a crappy secondary merge collector on them. Thus unless you get a new header you are not getting the full potential of N1's.


Is good to know that, i know that SR20s love big exhausts, but at this moment i have a SSAC header so i will have to get a better header to upgrade all the exhaust to 3"...
2012-06-20 13:27:05
#30
Originally Posted by CR
Is good to know that, i know that SR20s love big exhausts, but at this moment i have a SSAC header so i will have to get a better header to upgrade all the exhaust to 3"...


If you can, modify your SSAC merge and then you can also make it to be a 3" collector. If I stayed NA VE I would do that in a heart beat.

Examples:
http://www.sr20-forum.com/vvl/15581-check-out-my-custom-secondaries-downpipe.html
http://www.sr20-forum.com/vvl/48081-thoughts-modding-ssac-2.html#post633331

Now before anyone else jumps on my back about whole 3" deal. Yes there is power to be gained going 3", will you see that gain on a non-tuned setup though, probably not so much. All I meant to say is, header will yield you more gain and your money is better spent on the flywheel and staying with 2.5" exhaust.
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