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Thread: Twin scroll manifold options

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Posts: 11-20 of 57
2008-09-24 10:58:36
#11
The best off the shelf manifolds that are readily available probably are the Full Race manifolds i personally like the duel gate one best if going twin scroll but if designing your self i would much rather use steam pipe instead of cast stainless

this next bit of info is taken off another forum so i suppose i should quote it

"To build a good split pulse 4cyl turbo manifold takes a fair bit of knowledge in turbo specification, TURBO manifold design, fabrication skills, knowing what the right materials are and where to source them.

Completely divided split pulse turbo systems can work very well in high performance applications when done correctly but it is a lot easier to get these designs wrong over an open collector manifold design or equalised split pulse manifold design.

All three of these systems are different by design and have different requirements in manifold design, wastegates, turbo design & turbo specification.

The true completely divided split pulse systems are built to the firing order of the engine and keep the exhaust gases divided from both half’s of the manifold and exhaust housing scroll all the way to the turbine, and divided all the way to the valve on the wastegate or two wastegates are used.
(The twin wastegated 4cyl Full Race manifolds are a fine example of this system)

Equalised split pulse systems are built to the firing order but both half’s of the manifold are equalised. On after market manifolds this is usually done at the wastegate collector.
This is the most common split pulse manifold design.
(Your factory cast SR20DET manifold is of this design)

Open collector systems are the most common high performance manifolds.
They are exactly as they sound. They have an open collector and open exhaust housing.


Simplifying the requirements for the completely divided split pulse system;
Keeping the same compressor size. The turbo will perform better with a larger turbine and bigger exhaust housing A/R.
Not all turbo manufactures offer different turbine trims so most opt only for the bigger A/R housing. (I know of a turbo manufacture that does offer many different turbine trims. Wink Wink) LOL!
With a true completely divided split pulse system more wastegate is needed.
Where a single 44mm gate might have worked fine with the other systems on a decent power high performance 4cyl. You’re going to need a single 60+mm gate or two 38+mm gates with a completely divided system.
(The twin wastegated 4cyl Full Race manifolds are a fine example of the manifold design required for this system)
All the above requirements need to be addressed in these systems. Even if one of the requirements is not 100% correct it will not work any better than the other designs and/or could hinder performance."
2008-09-24 14:13:26
#12
I was thinking of making the manifold from sch 40 mild steel, then having it coated. I could go stainless, but this thickness of mild steel should never crack. I am not one to go cheap on the manifold, I will be buying the best one I can find. I would like to spool the gt30r turbo to over 300lb ft of torque by 4k. I think this is possible and will make the system a very potent street machine. I have practically had it with spool times. I would like to make this a quick-spooling design while still making 500whp.
2008-09-24 14:50:55
#13
Originally Posted by Coheed
I was thinking of making the manifold from sch 40 mild steel, then having it coated. I could go stainless, but this thickness of mild steel should never crack. I am not one to go cheap on the manifold, I will be buying the best one I can find. I would like to spool the gt30r turbo to over 300lb ft of torque by 4k. I think this is possible and will make the system a very potent street machine. I have practically had it with spool times. I would like to make this a quick-spooling design while still making 500whp.



Hi man.

sch 40 its overkill sch10 its more than Enough the sch40 its 3,76mm thick and with a inside diameter or 40mm aprox the sch 10 its 2,76mm thick and 42mm aprx inside diameter this will have a pretty importat affect on the spool and the top end of the motor wich one its better ? depends on the aplication.
Cheers.
2008-09-24 15:00:59
#14
Originally Posted by Coheed


who makes this?
2008-09-24 15:44:16
#15
Originally Posted by jpsr20det
Hi man.

sch 40 its overkill sch10 its more than Enough the sch40 its 3,76mm thick and with a inside diameter or 40mm aprox the sch 10 its 2,76mm thick and 42mm aprx inside diameter this will have a pretty importat affect on the spool and the top end of the motor wich one its better ? depends on the aplication.
Cheers.


Yes, sch 40 is thick, but will never crack. I have thought about using sch 10 but I would have to use a very good stainless to get the strength I want. Maybe 321? 304 would work, but it would need to be a lil thick to handle the everyday abuse.
2008-09-24 15:44:45
#16
Originally Posted by panapower
who makes this?


Pro-Tech fabrication!!! ftw.
2008-09-24 15:54:30
#17
Are you sure there is a twin scroll housing for the GT30R..?
2008-09-24 17:45:32
#18
I quit.
2008-09-24 18:04:30
#19
Does a compact Tomei RWD design help? It's not completely divided though... =(



http://www.240sxmotoring.com/tosrexma.html
2008-09-24 18:10:06
#20
Originally Posted by Coheed
Here is a single wastegate setup, but I really don't like how the bends seem to be, not sorted out. Full-race is great, don't get me wrong, but fluid dynamics shows that each bend acts like adding so much length to the pipe. Still a nice manifold at a great price.

Are you looking to make a ton of power running a lot of boost? If so, I wouldn't worry so much about the single wastegate outlet as long as there is a separator down the middle of it (to keep pulses split entirely). You shouldn't be concerned about wastegate flow unless you're trying to run low boost. High boost is happy with poor flowing wastegates. Low boost will get spikes and boost creep. Not issues you'll be having I bet.

Originally Posted by Coheed

This is the one I like, but it isn't twin scroll. But maybe it could be???


Switch cylinders around and add to wastegates??? I think it would flow quite well.
This is a bad manifold to start with. Cylinders 1 and 4 need to be paired, and the way they are "paired" right now is wrong. If you just split things down the middle the split would be 90° off when you mounted the turbo.
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