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Thread: Rear Sway Bar + Shocks/Struts...So what's next?

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Posts: 21-30 of 40
2013-05-24 18:02:40
#21
Re: Rear Sway Bar + Shocks/Struts...So what's next?
I had coilovers, extra braces good tyres etc on my car and found the rear end twitchy and could let go during hard cornering.
I fitted the rear bushing on their own and have not experienced above issues since. Old bushings looked to be in good condition removing them too as milage was not that high.
Thats my experience anyway and have heard the same from any other people who fitted them. This is in an n15 hatch not a b14.
2013-05-24 18:20:17
#22
Originally Posted by hammerin


Like all poly bushings, it will increase NVH. I can't comment on how much in my case because I went from a stock setup to 330lb springs on coilovers in the rear at the same time I did the bushings. The NVH definitely increased in my car. I just can't say to what degree the bushings are contributing to the NVH vs the new spring/damper combo.


No problem there

p.s. I had to Google what 'NVH' meant
2013-05-31 00:50:14
#23
So according to the ES instructions, I am to leave the inner ring *IN* and not take it out. I have read conflicting info on the net regarding this for the rear trailing arm bushings.

Anyone can confirm?
2013-05-31 02:54:44
#24
I cannot confirm but if I bought ES bushings, and the instructions are specific to the vehicle, I would listen to the instructions. Of all things, measure the diameter of the hole with the inner ring in and compare to the bushing diameter and see if they match and what is needed to make it right.

Hopefully someone can chime in that has used the same bushings to help you out further but there are some options for ya to solve it on your own right now. Good luck, sir!
2013-05-31 05:33:55
#25
Originally Posted by Kyle
I cannot confirm but if I bought ES bushings, and the instructions are specific to the vehicle, I would listen to the instructions. Of all things, measure the diameter of the hole with the inner ring in and compare to the bushing diameter and see if they match and what is needed to make it right.

Hopefully someone can chime in that has used the same bushings to help you out further but there are some options for ya to solve it on your own right now. Good luck, sir!


Ya my plan is to keep the ring unless someone says otherwise. I'm actually surprised the install notes are this specific. Usually they're pretty vague.

::EDIT::

Here are the instructions:

http://www.energysuspensionparts.com/Installation_Instructions/Energy_Suspension/17364.pdf

"Do not remove outer metal shell of bushing, it must be reused for this bushing set to work"

I do question their method of getting the bushing out:

"To remove rubber bushing, apply low heat evenly around the outside of the outer metal shell, just enough to brake the bond with the rubber. When you see light smoke coming from the sides of the bushing the bond should be broken. At no time should there be any flames coming from the rubber, if there are any flames, you need to back off with the heat. Just push the old rubber and inner metal sleeve out. Let the outer metal shell cool off before cleaning the inside."

ORLY?
Last edited by gomba on 2013-05-31 at 05-38-45.
2013-05-31 13:39:00
#26
Originally Posted by hammerin
I would have to disagree with that.

I have yet to run the SEL on track with my new poly bushings, but I can say for spirited street driving, my B14 feels the same as it did before. After having the beam/trailing arms detached from the car, it became apparent as to why. You can actual find lateral play in the trailing arms themselves from just pushing on them with your hands. In other words, the arms were designed with a flex factor build into them. Any sort of added stiffness from trailing arm bushings does nothing in terms of lateral movement because of the inherent flex in the metal. It's really the bushings in the lateral link that take all of the lateral pressure. Try and stiffen those, however, and I think the bind that insues does more harm than good. Which goes back to why the panhard works so well with solid heim joints combined with less of a travel arc to minimize bind.

It could be possible, people are seeing improvement with poly trailing arm bushings simple because their old bushing were total shot. The rubber bushings I replaced, relative to other cars I've seen, still had some life in them. The car only has 79,000 miles on it. My guess is that people would get the same improvements they see with poly bushing by simply replacing with stockers. My direct experience with this, for what it's worth.


I saw a huge improvement on my P11, I already had an Addco rear swaybar too. I'll let you be the judge of original bushing condition:



Originally Posted by hammerin

Like all poly bushings, it will increase NVH. I can't comment on how much in my case because I went from a stock setup to 330lb springs on coilovers in the rear at the same time I did the bushings. The NVH definitely increased in my car. I just can't say to what degree the bushings are contributing to the NVH vs the new spring/damper combo.


NVH increase was very minor in my car. I was worried it would be as bad as front lower control front bushing would be. Those made NVH horrible.

Originally Posted by gomba
So according to the ES instructions, I am to leave the inner ring *IN* and not take it out. I have read conflicting info on the net regarding this for the rear trailing arm bushings.

Anyone can confirm?


Leave the inner sleeve in, don't touch it!





Now I used B14 bushings on the P11, it looks like the P11 mount is bigger, thus the bushings went in with barely any force (I pushed them in by hand). I plan on replacing them with B15 bushings so that they deflect less inside the mount.



Here is why stock bushings suck, look at how small the contact patch is.
2013-05-31 14:52:24
#27
Huge improvement in what regard?
2013-05-31 15:27:54
#28
Hank, IIRC your running 333lbs springs. with that, you wont be able to feel the difference in the bushing like most with Hyperco or RM.

http://www.sr20-forum.com/brakes-suspension/65867-front-vs-rear-spring-rates.html#post887432

in that thread Mike K said
Strangely with the stock trailing arm bushings, I run stiffer rear springs as well. The stock bushings are so gushy, they don't allow the rear bar, including the stock one inside the twist beam to couple well. Once you get rid of the squishy rubber, man does the understeer go away. To me, its like a couple hundred in/lbs difference in spring.


These bushings are like going up 300 in/lbs in rear
spring rate! They make a bigger difference in chassis
balance than anything I have done so far. They also
eliminate the squirm and weird feeling out back.
Last edited by Keo on 2013-05-31 at 15-29-07.
2013-05-31 15:36:14
#29
That is one point where I failed with my B14, by the time I learned of the importance of the rear trailing arm bushings, I stopped trying, and began search for IRS-equipped cars.

If I fixed the rust when I first bought it nine years ago, things would be way different.
2013-05-31 15:39:23
#30
Looking forward to getting these bushings in!
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