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Thread: Cams question

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Posts: 11-20 of 42
2009-06-09 19:00:22
#11
Originally Posted by donttazmebro
as far as im concerned the real problem is the limitations of the motor

The VE motor was never designed to be a 2.0L


I believe the head is the biggest limitation
2009-06-09 19:22:43
#12
Originally Posted by donttazmebro
as far as im concerned the real problem is the limitations of the motor

The VE motor was never designed to be a 2.0L


I disagree. The VE was designed to be a 2.0. It's not an accident.

The head,block, bore size is based on a 2.0. The VE is the evolution of the SR20DE. They share the same 86mm bore, intake valve size(34mm). You can pretty much swap over most of the components. Remember the last generation of the VE are 2.0, the 20V, 20VE-T.

The SR16 is the bastard child.
2009-06-09 22:47:56
#13
The VE was designed to be a 1.6L

Just because it's a 53j block doesn't mean anything
2009-06-10 05:32:09
#14
Originally Posted by donttazmebro
The VE was designed to be a 1.6L

Just because it's a 53j block doesn't mean anything


LOL, it means everything. The block is the base you build the engine around. Nissan saved money by not having to produce a new block for the SR16. They just slapped on a shorter crank and longer rods onto the 2.0 block and get a 1600 cc engine. That's all the difference between the 2.0 and 1.6.

Nissan sells a lot more Primera than Pulsar. The money and design went to the car that is the bigger seller. There is more consideration for Primera.The Primera required the 2.0.

SR16 is just an iteration of the 2.0. It's an incremental change to the 2 liter base.

Lets look at two other very popular 1600cc engine, the Toyota 4AGE and Honda B16A. These two engines were design from the beginning to be 1.6 liter.

4AGE 81mm bore x 77mm stroke

B16A 81mm bore x 77.4mm stroke

SR16 86mm bore x 68.7mm stroke

Guess which one is the odd ball.
2009-06-10 12:56:03
#15
I agree. The sr16 is like the b16 in a lot of ways. Just a destroked version of the same motor in most respects.
2009-06-10 16:20:22
#16
The sr16 is nothing like a b16. If you had a K16 and a K20 then you might have something to discuss.

Just because a motor uses a 86m bore doesn't mean anything.

But that's ok, people that haven't built motors don't really know what they are talking about. People that haven't had conversations with the companies that make cams don't know what they are talking about. People that haven't done standalone tune's and have seen how the intake and exhaust affect power and why don't know what they are talking about. And finally people that think just because a cam holds power to 9krpm even though they aren't making **** for power don't know what they are talking about.


The VE motor was designed from intake to timing events to header to be a 68mm stroke. The 20VE is an afterthought and it shows in the lack of power.

But since no one here has actually built a 16ve no one here will understand...

Here's a simple question that if any of you had actually spoke to cam producers would easily be able to answer: Why is it so difficult to make better performing cams than N1's on a stock 20VE? it's not due to lack of technology or demand since at least 3 companies have tried.
2009-06-10 16:49:07
#17
I think the fact that N1's were designed for the SR16 is where people get confused. Like Mr donttazme said - the timing events are set up for the shorter stroke motor. To make good power with a SR20, you have to use cam gears as well as seperate intake and exhaust switch points.
2009-06-10 19:34:52
#18
Originally Posted by donttazmebro
The sr16 is nothing like a b16. If you had a K16 and a K20 then you might have something to discuss.

Just because a motor uses a 86m bore doesn't mean anything.

But that's ok, people that haven't built motors don't really know what they are talking about. People that haven't had conversations with the companies that make cams don't know what they are talking about. People that haven't done standalone tune's and have seen how the intake and exhaust affect power and why don't know what they are talking about. And finally people that think just because a cam holds power to 9krpm even though they aren't making **** for power don't know what they are talking about.


The VE motor was designed from intake to timing events to header to be a 68mm stroke. The 20VE is an afterthought and it shows in the lack of power.

But since no one here has actually built a 16ve no one here will understand...

Here's a simple question that if any of you had actually spoke to cam producers would easily be able to answer: Why is it so difficult to make better performing cams than N1's on a stock 20VE? it's not due to lack of technology or demand since at least 3 companies have tried.


Was that directed at me? Because I've done all the above.
2009-06-10 20:06:18
#19
it's directed at anyone uneducated in how the VE works and that foolishly believes that the motor was designed as a 2L

this is all too funny...seriously i haven't even begun to go into detail about all the things that prove the 20ve was an afterthought yet people want to have a 'technical' debate

Why does the 16ve and 20ve have the same stock intake manifold?

To be clear im talking about both of these motors outside of the 20v and VET
2009-06-10 20:32:01
#20
Interesting thread..........Keep discussing.
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